Інтерв’ю з “мобіком” із Москви: Як запроторили за грати і відправили на війну

I address the Russians who are watching us. Interviews of your soldiers will not be shown on federal channels share this video among your friends and relatives, especially in Russian social networks, so that more people will know the truth about the war -What's your full name?
-Vetrov Andrey Viktorovich -Date of birth?
-1980 -Where are you from?
-Moscow -You're a Muscovite?
-Yes -Are you a mobilized?
-Yes -Describe how it happened -I received drafting summons on the 8th with the requirement of showing up I came to the assembly point and got into the army like that -What month was it?
-8th of October -Did you have any experiences prior?
-I was never in the army before -How did you get into the army then? Even without mandatory service?
-I had no mandatory service -Why? It's important in Russia
– I had a call for mandatory service in 1998 I don't know how much the army needed us at the time I didn't hide. There were no drafting summons, no one called. So I didn't get into the army like that -Did you have any training?
-Yes, we drove there to train I swore an oath in Moscow, in Moscow Higher Military Command School Then we trained in Kantemir Tank Division, it's in Moscow region, Naro-Fominsk -It's an elite division as far as I know
-I can't say, but it is in the name Then we were brought to Moscow, Mosrentgen settlement There I was assigned into the 27th Separate Guards Sevastopol Motor Rifle Brigade.

That's where I got a weapon and there we trained for 3 weeks -What kind of troop were you?
-Private machine gunner I was a gunner. Upon arrival in Urazovo we had no machine gunners, so I was assigned as one -Did you train with a machine gun? Do you know how it works?
-I was shown how to disassemble and assemble it, but I never shot from it -When did you invade Ukraine?
-I'll tell you right now On 27th of 29th of November -Which direction?
-We were positioned in Urazovo -That's in…
-It's Belgorod region, near Valyuki -So that's Kharkiv.

Valyuki is bordering… Valyuki is Kharkiv region I'll be honest, I study geography of Russia with everyone here, where they're from Yes, Urazovo is like going to Kupyansk Which settlement did you stop in in Ukraine?
-As it turned out, near Novoselovka, where I was captured -When?
-On 13th of January -So you could say that you fought for a month and a half
-No, we were thrown into the fields between Svatovo and Novoselovka It was 12 kilometers to Svatovo. We had a task to dig trenches. We stayed there for probably 18 days But on 17th of December we began moving towards Novoselovka on foot. I may be mistaking days, so we began moving towards it since December 18th -How were you captured? -I understood that your counteroffensive had begun.

We were shelled at the point, where we were tasked with observing Out of habit we went into hiding. 10 minutes later we came out and saw that around us were your troops -AFU?
-They didn't say who they were, but they were army men. I can't say who it was -You're in captivity since December, right?
-No, I was captured in January I was caught on 13th of January
-On old New Year's Eve -Yes. On 19th of January I was brought to Kharkiv -What did you do before mobilization?
-I was in jail. I was jailed in 2016 and freed in 2022 -What were you jailed for in 2016?
-For bribing police -What's the story?
-They arrested me, because supposedly something was wrong with the car They began provoking me, as we call it forced bribery -It was police, right?
-Yes.

I had to give them money and was caught doing so I was sentenced to 8 years of prison in Valyuki I served 5 and a half years, then came the benefits. I wrote a pardon. The court approved it and released me on 4th of February -And then on 24th of February began the invasion Question: what kind of honest policeman did you get? There's corruption. Police takes bribes, but here you got caught -I understood that I just wasn't needed As in it's better to jail him than think of what else to do with him. That's why I still haven't figured out who it was.

I just understood that it was easier to get rid of me like that -What did you do before you were jailed?
-I had a business -Which?
-Car pawn shop -Explain what that is
-Money secured against cars -Was it a serious business? I mean was the payment good?
-I wouldn't say it was good, but I had enough for life -Do you have a family?
-I have 3 children and a divorced wife -3 children? How old are they?
-The oldest is 17, the younger ones are 8 and 9 years old -When you were released, before the drafting summons, you had…
-20 days before the war began -20 days before the war, but drafting summons before October, yes? What did you do before that? -I was coming to my senses. Talked to those whom I haven't talked to for some time, played with my children, because they grew up without me I had more time in summer, so I spent more time with my children -Who goes to war more? The mobilized?
-The mobilization had ended.

Whoever now goes, goes via contract, I think -I mean the majority. The big wave were the mobilized with whom you fought alongside -The wave was crazy I observed and saw that a lot were mobilized from Moscow The first place we were brought to was the park "Patriot" in Moscow region, near Nora-Faminsk There were lots of people, specifically from Moscow region -What do the people say between each other? -Most people live with their small problems like small people: family, work Here comes the drafting summons, as in your motherland calls you, they stood up and went But most people don't even understand what is happening, they're just not interested, even ordinary men Ordinary working men are whom I met with from the mobilized There were no people with higher education No commanders, no anyone, just ordinary guys -Do they believe in "Motherland calls you, you need to go"?
-As civilians of their government, they have to, because there's a criminal liability, a serious one.

And once again they have to go -Do you have higher education?
-No -Secondary special education?
-Yes -Which specialty?
-Something to do with cars. I never worked by my specialty It was in 2014, I don't even remember what I graduated
-You don't even remember that? -Look, you say that motherland is calling. Calling for what? Can you explain? -I explained their opinion. The motherland just calls, but what it calls for is what comes from our TV screens, you can perfectly see what it is -To be honest, I sometimes watch your news, only to see what Solovyov or Skabeeva, Simonyan say -Yes, if you sit and watch from morning to evening these shows you'll be like a zombie I don't know the ratings, other people do that, but I think people got so tired, that the ratings of these shows are now minimal Although, they're given a good amount of time for TV, but as soon as one ends, the second begins -And everything is about Ukraine
-As a rule How many times I watched, you deny the brotherhood, but brothers don't come to you on tanks and teach you how to live Free, independent country.

Why teach something anyone here? -What do you mean by denying brotherhood? You mean Ukrainians? -Whoever I talked to said that we're different "You always occupied us" I always heard that. I asked how, what about mutual history? They said the only mutual history between us is that Russians always occupied us -It was like that, it's a fact If you look at it from a historical point of view, it's a fact As I understood I'm not the only one who thinks like that, most do with whom you've talked here -Most people, yes -I'll ask differently. According to Ukraine's Ministry of Defense estimates around 150,000 Russians died -It's horrible numbers -What did they die for? Because motherland called? What's the goal of this war? What were you mobilized for and what did you fight for? Can you explain? I can't.

I never had any desires, any goals to destroy Ukrainians for being Ukrainians We have a very serious criminal liability for ignoring the government's calls, who tells you that you need to pay tribute to your country I think you know that when mobilization was announced many people fled to neighboring countries -Yes, I saw and heard that
-It was a mess I talked to taxi drivers, I had no drafting summons at the time, they said that in airports were military guards, who stood on checkpoints and gave out drafting summons With whom I was mobilized, they said that people were just detained on streets, their documents were taken and told "Come to the enlistment office to get them back." But there they handed out drafting summons People had to go, because when someone signed a drafting summon, they took it and hid I don't remember how many years you're given for it, but it's a serious crime -I have a question: you said most of them are small people, ordinary people You also said that you don't consider us a brotherly nation.

I'll go a bit deeper A week or 2 weeks ago we had a survey Ukrainians think that Russians are to blame for this war as well, ordinary Russians. Almost 90% of Ukrainians think like that Because it all happens with their tacit consent With their tacit consent, including yours, because mobilized, came here to fight in another country What do you think? Almost 90% of Ukrainians think that That it's not only Putin's fault, but Russian's as well -Of course, because we're driving on the machine we started. I personally sat on a tank and came here. It's obvious that I'm the part of the fault I mean how can people not go? Do all have to gather and say "I won't kill Ukrainians"? And once again, the mobilized aren't well informed of the situation, like me. That we will act like police on checkpoints It's entirely different from being ideologically triggered or motivated elsewise End up on the front and engage in destroying Everyone thinks that they'll be somewhere on the side of this I remember that my tribute to my motherland is on the side And once again, to not go is to sabotage this whole thing.

There's a big criminal liability for that as well Many people have suffered already for simply calling things by their own names, for calling this war, not special operation Now they're at fault too. So it's not easy for everyone -You're offering imagine myself in Russian's shoes, right?
-No -Ok, then what's the solution?
-If someone asked for my opinion, then this war won't end soon How does an ordinary person think? That it should be peaceful and quiet
-Yes -Our leaders think differently about it.

They won't listen to our words It has to ended somehow, because 2 slavic nations are just destroying each other and for what goals? Why? -Look, when we talk about his situation, the fact that there are such laws in Russia, that there's such a situation, that there's such a government. Whose problem is it? It's an internal problem of Russians, right?
-We choose our leaders, of course -Do you attend elections?
-I haven't attended them for a long time -But before you have?
-I don't remember, probably not -But have you ever voted?
-Maybe -You were born in 1980, you're 42 years old, right?
-Yes -So who did you vote for as a president?
-I don't remember -Okay, which political power?
-I'm closer to Soviet Union -You're grieving, right?
-Not that I support communists, but I liked the order back then -We're almost peers, I was born in 1981 and you were born in 1980.

You're Russian, I'm Ukrainian. Explain what you liked about USSR, because I remember almost nothing I was little at the time. I was 8 years old. USSR collapsed and that's all I remember What did you like about it?
-Not that I liked it, I experienced it's worst times, when everything was falling apart When everyone were separating, when there was like a mania of freedom I remember when in 1991 we had our first coup in Moscow, when people felt that everyone were leaving -Ok, that's the question. What was good in USSR?
-People were thought of. If a person had no flat, he obtained it If a person had no education, they could get it.

All social steps were open for people, which are now closing There was growing a massive community, which was 10,000 times bigger, but back then it was a few times bigger, right? How was a person different from another? Some professors or academics had a flat and a maid, personal cars and more Per good jobs were good things, through connections That's how one person was different from another A person didn't live in crap so he could lose his job and not be able to pay mortgage There are such flat prices that it's good, that the mortgage is like a rock on the neck, as in the person always lives in stress If he loses a good job, with which he planned to pay mortgage, that's it, he'll lose everything That's why I'm like "build that." Not what I saw in my childhood, but originally, how it all started -I'll tell you this thing.

I said that we're peers, I mean I don't remember USSR, so I can't compare it with something But I read lots of books about what it was like I have a 70 year old mom, she was born in USSR. We had a conversation a year ago. I asked my mom "Mom, do you want Soviet Union to come back? Or is it better now?" What do you think she said?
-I think she said no in accordance to her reasons -Yes, she said no. Although, she was born in USSR, lived in it and so on So she lived most of her life in USSR
-You can't return what what already happened -Yes, but she doesn't want it. She says "I'm proud for my country, I'm proud that I'm Ukrainian. Yes, we had tough times in 90's and 2000's." -We had tough times as well -Yes, but now I see that you have more potential, because if a person wants something, they work for it -That's true -If we talk about USSR, then for example, for my country, for Ukraine, it was a regime I know a lot about GULAGs, about Ukrainians that rotted there, about freedom that was absent, about equality for everyone and elite party that lived well And 100 rubles that everyone received, with which you couldn't get out
-There's truth in your words I just said it differently, a more fair community.

And a person had less stress than now -It all depends on the person
-I agree -If it was that good in USSR, why does Ukraine want into EU? She wants a capitalistic program. Why? -It's your right. We live in the same system right now -Which?
-Capitalism as well -No, you live in dictatorship system
-We're told it's in form of capitalism -Yes, but it's not capitalism You understand that it's not capitalism, but dictatorship? There's no freedom of speech
-There supposedly is, but if I talk freely I'll get hurt -Are you afraid?
-Of course -Ok, I'll say differently. I always do this comparison Norway is a small country, right?
-Yes -The quality of life is the best in the world. It's a number one country And Russia, a big country with big natural resources When I was in Norway, in Oslo for a week, I talked to Norwegians. They all spoke in English. not Norwegian And they told me that when they found oil, Norway is an oil country but small They call it "oil tale". They began accumulating all the money and made a fond They knew that the oil will eventually end, but they have next generation.

All those money they prepared for the next generation -Like how Arabs did
-Yes, Arabs did the same Why didn't Russia do the same?
-I'm just an ordinary person, I don't know Because the money were invested into other goals -Into palaces. We understand each other, right?
-Yes -Where am I going with this? That Russians aren't interested in that. It's people's domain, right? -People's domain, but not all -I mean, according to the law it's people's domain, but such benefits are used by other people But they always talk about Ukraine You said yourself that there are always talks only about Ukraine on TV -Yes, there are lots of shows discussing that topic -That's the whole absurd
-Well, yes People's attention is retracted from the main problems
-It's all redirected to Ukraine Why not take a person like you and say "Everything is tied to mortgage.

This is f*cked." Why can other capitalistic counties like USA be able to live with credits and everything is normal, but Russia lives with credits and everything is bad See what I mean? That's why I ask. Returning back to the question. What you said before is all Russia's internal problems. It's Russian people who need to deal with them -Yes, but how? -Let people decide Who's the source of authority in Russia? -I don't fully understand your question -Who is the source of power in Russia?
-I guess the president -In Ukraine, according to law, the source of authority is people Look, if you asked me who's the source of power in Ukraine I'd answer you immediately: people Here many times the answer was president. Putin is the president Although it's differently written in your constitution, but it has gone so far, that the president is a Tsar and everyone else are peasants and those peasants admit it -Well, peasants…
-That's how it seems -This leader has been in our authority for a long time and he's recognized in the world.

Boris Yeltsin is respected and he remained in power well Even foreign press wrote about him not long ago -He's not handheld right now
-Right now we're covered in blood and the whole world thinks of us as outcasts I don't know how to get out of it Let the big heads think, but I see that there's no way out of this -What if all mobilized troops stopped and said "Stop. We won't go."
-Deploy guns and just like in 17th year They're afraid of chaos and destruction, because we always live in some instability
-Do you understand that destruction is only a matter of time? Sanctions and so on The world is global When there was USSR we also lived under sanctions.

It just got closed -That's not the scariest, right?
-No -Wanna say anything to Ukrainians?
-I wanted to say, but… Any nonsense can come into mind at first It's sad that 2 slavic nations are slaughtering each other with such crazy hatred. And with each fallen missile the ditch between our governments and people become wider That's the scariest thing, because we were always friends We never had many derivatives. We didn't make any distinctions. We never looked into the passport, we looked at a person's personal traits Now nobody cares about it If I'm a Russian I'm an outcast to the world. If a Ukrainian talks to me and finds out I'm Russian, he'll just turn away from me for what's happening here -Why do you think so? -It's my opinion, because of what I came over here.

People are pulling us out on conversations like "What are you doing here? Why did you come here?" "We don't need to be liberated." "Did you Banderites here? Did you fascists?" I said I didn't -Do they ask the right questions?
-Yes -Do they slaughter Russians like they slaughter Ukrainians?
-I'm captured, sitting in front of you. In the first days I've been treated by Ukrainians Three meals a day, good attitude, maybe not deserved, but it's present So, people, even when gritting their teeth, due to personal motives may be treating you humanely I met many people here, being in captivity, it's very pleasant It gives me hope, that maybe the ditch isn't as big, that maybe our children and grandchildren will be able to shake hands -The ditch is very big
-I understand that With each new missile it becomes bigger -Wanna say anything to Russians? -I don't even know What can I tell them? -You're a Russian, you should know how to address your people
-I stated my opinion regarding everything I've seen here Let them form their opinions from my words -Do you want to be exchanged?
-Of course.

I have a family and acquaintances -What if they call you back in? -I wouldn't like that at all. I don't even know Going under the saw to cut off an arm or a leg, I don't know Going to the nuthouse, I don't know I have problems with health. I'll complain about it If I get to go back home, let them work on it I have no desire to be back on the front -How to end the war? -It's very hard And once again whoever denies opinions of ordinary people should figure it out You can't fight the people, you can only destroy them, but you won't let that happen and half the world is with you. That's why it needs to cease General Lebed said a very good line: "Every war ends with peace." -Sooner or later
-But how many bloody rivers have to be spilled? Do people really need to bathe in them every time? Why can't we negotiate? -Why do you say humanity? Who started the war? -The war began long ago.

It's active since 2014
-Who started it? -Everyone knows how it started You had a redistribution of power, unrest began I remember the starting point began with many volunteers, when they saw the Odesa events It motivated people a lot They really thought that their help was needed. That was the first wave Then Donetsk and Luhansk Russia entered this conflict and we as participants of it have been in the war since 2014 Right now it's openly, clearly, but back then it was different, I remember there weren't spillovers from the TV that we participate in the war It was even said that we were helping those and those, that we're not stopping the flow of volunteers, because we have open borders But there were no Russian regular forces in the conflict -Maybe everything began earlier? From Crimea?
-Yes, I forgot about Crimea -It all began from Crimea
-Yes -Russians just don't understand that we'll restore our historical borders sooner or later
-They understand this war won't stop until it gets to that point -They understand that?
-I can't say for everyone, but if someone thinks, then those thoughts don't leave them -It's usually said that it began from Crimea and should end in Crimea You understand what I mean?
-It's the hardest I think you have to come to compromises in that scenario -How do you talk about compromises with Russia and how can you trust Russia? Russia should first leave the occupied territories, right? Or should it be left for Russia? Even when people there wait for Ukraine?
-It's a very hard question, I can't definitively answer you I think Ukrainian's opinion changed every year, because I know many people from Belgorod, who visited your Kharkiv every weekend -Yes
-And it was very good.

Some went for shopping, some just came to have a walk -Yes, that's true
-Yes. That's why I'm saying, no one made any differences No one even noticed the borders, but now what? I also always wanted to visit Ukraine. Well, here we are. I've been to Kharkiv, Kyiv for 10 days, now, you could say, I got to the border On the opposite, I'm in Lviv now, right?
-No, not in Lviv. In Western Ukraine -Somewhere close
-In Western Ukraine -I assume that I'll never see Ukraine again
-Most likely yes -It's very sad -It's kind of legitimate
-Yes, it is And if I come back home from Ukraine, I'll probably never see Europe either -You have a 17 year old son, right?
-A daughter -How old is the son?
-I have 3 daughters.

All 3 are girls They won't be taken into the army -It's just that when you return your daughter will ask you "Dad, what did you fight for here?" After all there's ideology when countries fight
-It will be hard to explain that to children I won't even talk about this to my younger daughters As for my older daughter… I can't give a simple answer to that question at the moment.